We are all familiar with the phrase, “I’m sorry but the guarantee has run out so there’s nothing we can do”. This is often a complete lie – at least in many cases. If the manufacturer’s engineer says it then technically it is true because they have no obligation under the sale of goods act – but the retailer does. Retailers can’t just fob us off. Here is just one example which proves that this response is not always true.
Expensive coffee machine example
A Which? member bought an “expensive” coffee machine and after 30 months it broke down suffering a serious fault. This is 18 months out of guarantee. However, Which? advised him that an expensive coffee machine should be expected to last more than 2 and a half years so he was entitled to have it repaired free of charge by the retailer who had sold him a product that was not of satisfactory quality.
Had the fault been relatively minor the advice may have been different, likewise, if the coffee machine had been a cheap one, or it had been used in an abnormally heavy way such as in a works canteen. We can’t take it for granted that any fault on any appliance at 2 and a half years should be repaired free of charge under the sale of goods act, but it’s useful to have real life examples like this as a yard stick because it can help us gauge our own circumstances.
Out of guarantee appliances
When relating to washing machines or other white goods appliances it will depend on how much it cost, how it has been used, and what’s gone wrong. If you buy an expensive appliance (especially a brand which sells on a high quality image) which suffers an expensive breakdown after a few years you may be entitled to a free repair if you have used it normally and looked after it. I have heard of people winning cases when drum bearings have failed on washing machines almost 5 years old.
Peter Tyson Appliances give high quality service coupled with special offers and competitive prices on carefully chosen white goods.
Conversely, if you paid £199 for a budget washer, and used it every day – twice a day – to wash for a family of 5 and it is exhausted and scrap after 3 years, it may well be that this is acceptable due to the cheapness of the appliance and the hard life it’s had. Even with such a short life it would have only cost £66 per year – £1.27 a week. I would think £1.27 a week to do 14 washes is pretty reasonable. So it’s necessary to try and look at the whole picture before deciding if you should be disgruntled or not.
Forbes rent appliances and specialise in renting Bosch appliances so they know them inside out. They also rent other brands and many other products – more details at Forbes
Consumer Rights Act 2015 doesn’t cover all breakdowns
It’s important to be aware that the sale of goods act does not say that an appliance or product should never break down, or even that it shouldn’t break down before a certain time period (other than the first 6 months in which case it would be deemed to have an inherent fault). It says they should last a reasonable time and be free from inherent faults.
Relatively minor faults are not the issue in my opinion, it’s very expensive faults – especially those that aren’t economical to repair or cannot be repaired by design. Sadly, too much is open to (mis)interpretation and most retailer’s staff still say there’s nothing they can do once it is out of guarantee, but this is completely untrue in many cases. They too often completely ignore their responsibilities under the sale of goods act.
Another example
Here’s another example (from Which? legal). A customer had an automatic garage door fitted, which came with a 2 year guarantee. During the guarantee a part failed twice and was replaced. However, when the same part failed again 8 months outside the guarantee the company claimed he had to pay because it was out of guarantee. Which? said this was untrue. Under the Sale of Goods act goods should be of satisfactory quality and this includes being durable, so the same part failing 3 times in 3 years is definitely not complying.
Which? advised him he was entitled to a free repair. In this case, the company involved still refused so he was able to claim from the credit card company who eventually agreed it was jointly liable under section 75 of the Credit Act. If they hadn’t agreed to pay, he would have had to take the garage company to the small claims court.
There’s another example of a customer with an iPhone which was 4 months out of guarantee faced with a £130 bill because the on off switch went faulty. She eventually got compensation for the repair costs (with help from Which?) from T-mobile who had repeatedly refused to accept any liability. They eventually paid up when taken to the small claims court (without accepting any liability).
Is this why we have so much trouble getting appliances repaired or replaced when faulty?
The current system doesn’t work properly because it relies on the good will of the retailer to own up and admit they have a responsibility to repair or replace some appliances when they are out of the manufacturers guarantee. In practice, because the manufacturer has no obligation under the sale of goods act then once their guarantee has run out they tend to wash their hands of any problems. The retailers are then left to to foot the entire bill, and they don’t like it. For a more in depth look at this problem see here – Is the sale of goods act too hard on retailers?
R Grillo says
I had a dispute a Shower manufacturer over a 7 month old spare part failure. The spare was purchased direct from the company. Initially the company hid behind its 90 day parts warranty, but, after the CAB and Trading Standards were brought into the matter, the company asked me to post the faulty part to the head office, and issued a replacement a day or two later.
I’d replaced the shower by then with one of another brand. Still, the new and used spare parts got me a few quid back on ebay, so it was worth the hassle.
Whitegoodshelp (Andy Trigg) says
Hi: Many people don’t realise the sale of goods act also applies to spare parts bought or even fitted by an engineer. In my opinion 90 day guarantees are disgraceful and imply to me that a company isn’t serious about customer’s rights. The idea that you can charge someone say, £250 for a new motor for example, and then try to insist it is only guaranteed for 90 days would be comical if it wasn’t such a serious problem. A new part should be fit for purpose, last a reasonable time and be free from inherent faults just the same as a brand new appliance.
The reality is there is no law which obliges any company to guarantee anything. Our rights are all tied up in the sale of goods act, anything else is just as the phrase goes, in addition to our statutory rights. Clearly 90 days will never stand up in a small claims court but it will fob many people off. Well done for fighting it.
Joan Morgan says
I have an idea it fridge which was purchased on 15/11/14 …fridge part WS never that cold till one morning it was warm I mean really warm rang indesut whobadvised defrost for 48 hours did this no change finlky had an engineer 02/07/15 who confirmed it was faulty and said in future models will have different compressor/ thermostat ….well again its warm and upon ringing indesit they said out of warranty part replaced was only 90 day warranty and tried to sell me extended warranty …..argos who I purchased from ate telling me its indesit and replaced part was guaranteed for 12 months from fitting indesit are saying contact argos argos are saying indedit …..argos and indesit have both said I need an engineers report £109 charge and then they will think about repair ….can I claim this charge back if fault is proven ? And what happens then am I entitled to repair or refund and if so off who ? Retailer or indesit ? Thank you iml completely getting passed from one to the other x
Andy Trigg (Whitegoodshelp) says
Hello Joan, there are links in my article above which explain Is manufacturer or retailer responsible for faulty appliances?.
Jay oldsmith says
The fact that manufacturers are allowed to make inferior products with such a short life and then refuses to repair them contributes massively to the mountains of pollution. Take a look at the images online of huge heaps of useless white goods. It is a hidden issue which needs highlighting,
We should be fixing everything we can to reduce the terrible impact on the planet that these goods have. Take a look on Trust Pilot at all the major brands. They all get one star. They all all the same. They should be called to account and we can all do that by demanding our rights. That way we help the planet too.
Andy Trigg (Whitegoodshelp) says
Hello J. Yes I’ve been saying this for at least the last 10 years. I have written many articles (including this one Do we really need to dump our old inefficient appliances?) Unfortunately though, the truth is that there are already appliances that are greatly superior in build quality and longevity, and much better for the environment (eg Miele). But they remain niche products because most people will not pay out the extra cost for them.
At the end of the day it’s the the public’s fault in my opinion. Despite modern advances in environmental campaigns and thinking, the vast majority of people prefer short termism in exchange for cheaper prices. I doubt that any government will enforce better build quality because essentially poor build quality needing constant replacement and sold at cheap prices are at the heart of the economy. If you were to force all manufacturers to build products that were of sufficient quality to rarely break down and last for a minimum of 15 to 20 years then two things would happen. Prices would catastrophically rise. Most products would probably quadruple in price. Selling a high quality product that lasts for a long time doesn’t need replacing or repairing often is not a very good business model unless you are charging a very high premium price for it.
The second thing that would happen would be the economy would crash as millions of jobs selling, repairing manufacturing packaging all these products just drain away. It’s sad but true I’m afraid. Of course if the world genuinely is in danger it will have to be done at some point.
Jo says
Not sure if this thread is still read. I have a washing machine purchased in January 2020 so just out of warranty . Would this be covered, as the machine is now banging loudly during spin cycle. It was a lower range price model but I would have expected at least two years . Would I be wrong to expect that length of time owing to the price £199 btw it had been reduced in a sale at the time ,or have I just been unlucky ? . As you have already stated think the fact that you just get fobed off by them saying it is out off warranty, and the cost of repair . A new one can usually be bought .
Andy Trigg (Whitegoodshelp) says
Hello Jo. I still think even a cheap washing machine should last longer than 14 months. The problem is that until you know exactly what has gone wrong and how much it will cost t fix you don’t know if it’s something you should fight about or not. So say for example it was just something that had come loose and wasn’t too expensive to repair, contrasted with if it was going to cost £150. You need to have it looked at to determine the fault and then decide if it’s worth complaining to the retailer that it hasn’t lasted a reasonable time. But by that time you’ve already committed to paying the engineer.
David says
Hi, our new build home came fitted out with Neff appliances, but our Washer dryer has gone faulty after 2.5 years (so 6 months out of warranty). We’re being quoted £100 call out, plus (as they expect it’s the heating element) another £160 plus labor to complete the fix. I understand the comments on the budget purchases, but I wouldn’t have expected a more premium product to go faulty in such a short time? Do we have any route to push back on this?
Andy Trigg (Whitegoodshelp) says
Hello David. Neff are supposed to be a higher end quality appliance. They have always had a good reputation for quality, albeit with very expensive repair and spare parts prices. I would imagine your washer dryer was very expensive, though the cost may have been hidden inside the price of the house. I think it is fair to say that such an expensive appliance shouldn’t really be breaking down and requiring very expensive repairs after 2 1/2 years but there are no actual rules on this, it is essentially a matter of opinion. And therein lies the problem.
That is of course assuming it’s not been heavily used. Whether or not we have a justifiable complaint is not only dependent on the quality and price of the appliance, but also on how it has been used. So for example if it was used eight or nine times a week and the dryer was used every time it might be considered heavy use, and expectations might have to be adjusted. But if it has just being used normally, then you may well have a case under the consumer’s right act 2015.
Any such case would be against the retailer, but if it came as part of the house then presumably in legal terms you bought it from the builders of your house. Unfortunately builders tend not to be so good at dealing with this kind of thing. As far as they’re concerned they install the appliances and if anything goes wrong the manufacturer fixes it. Once the guarantee has run out that’s it.
But they are completely wrong if they are the people who took your money. Under the consumer rights act they have an obligation to repair, compensate, or replace an appliance if it is deemed to have breached the act. The problem is of course that many of these things are subjective and retailers usually deny that they have breached the act. If they don’t agree with you, and as it is going to cost them a lot of money it’s no surprise they most likely won’t, then you are left with a fight on your hands.
There is nothing in the consumer rights act that says an appliance should not break down, or we should be compensated if one does break down after 2 1/2 years. So if you have a valid claim you have to argue that, as with the examples quoted in my article, it is unreasonable for a part to have failed so relatively quickly on a high-end and expensive appliance.
In these circumstances the manufacturers will almost always also deny any responsibility. There is always a slight possibility that a manufacturer might voluntarily offer a free repair, cheaper repair, or a discount on a new one so there’s no harm in testing them out, but do not be remotely surprised if they don’t happily give you a free repair.
So where does that leave you? Sadly, as I’ve grown to realise over the years, especially (when I’ve had my own consumer issues), in the UK we have excellent theoretical consumer rights that are routinely ignored and denied by retailers. As I’ve said many times they know very well that if they refuse to do anything than 99% of people do not have the stomach for a fight. If you do then I would suggest enlisting the help of a consumer group like Which? Or the citizens advice bureau. Alternatively they seem to be a few consumer disputes help sites that mediate between consumers and companies so you might want to try and find some of those.