I still get people asking if I know of any washing machines with a hot water valve. This article gives a few suggestions – but you should read on first to fully understand the issue. It is not as simple as you might think. It could be a complete waste of your time looking for one.
Most washing machines now only have a cold water valve but many people instinctively don’t like this. We all know washing machines wash with hot water, so it seems crazy not to use the hot water we already have in our homes. Heating it all up from cold seems wasteful and unnecessary.
This apparent madness is even more annoying for people who have an environmentally friendly and economic source of hot water such as solar powered.
However, there is a good argument that because modern washing machines use so little water on wash – there is no need for a hot valve. It’s in fact more economical to use cold fill only on 40 ° washes for most (but not all) people as explained here – is a hot & cold fill washing machine more economical?.
What is the science behind cold fill only washing machines?
All this is explained fully in my article Should I buy a cold fill washing machine?
So are there any washing machines with a hot valve?
At the time of writing there are some LG & Statesman models with a hot valve. However, they don’t take in hot water at all unless you use a very hot wash cycle. There is alternatively a British made washing machine with a hot water valve. Ebac’s hot & cold fill washing machine is advertised as using, “Intelligent hot fill technology”.
Some Hotpoint washing machines appear to be hot and cold fill, but they are designed for cold fill because there’s only a cold fill hose supplied and a y-piece adaptor supplies both valves.
I suspect this is a temporary measure, and that subsequent models will just have the cold valve.
So hot and cold fill washing machines are currently very rare. But even if you find one, you need to know that the few I’ve seen rarely even use the hot water valve.
If most of your wash cycles are done at 40 degrees or less it will most likely never use the hot valve at all.
Related:
Several people have asked me if you can connect an environmentally friendly and economic hot supply to the cold valve to utilise it. The short answer is no, for more details read Don’t connect the hot water supply to the cold valve on cold fill washing machine
New comments on this topic have been closed. There were over 600 comments now trimmed down (below) to 233. There are very interesting discussions there.
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The fact is that if a manufacturer gave you an absolute free choice; high/low levels and/or /hot/cold water they would not get their much coveted energy efficiency ratings.
At a time when we are being encouraged to use as little and at least impact it is entirely correct that manufacturers enforce best practice provided it brings about the best washes at the least environmental impact and with due concern for any individuals particular requirements on reasonable issues such as skin complaints.
Thanks for your point Mark: I agree, and have said many times that most people are better off or at least no worse off with a cold fill. The problem is though that it’s only the “majority” of people, which leaves room for a significant amount of people who would be better off and use less energy if their washing machine had a hot valve (as I also keep mentioning). A way round the problem you raise would be for all the features you mention to be optional extras and the washing machine by default would not use them. Therefore it could still get the energy efficiency rating because that’s what it is capable of doing, and does by default. The same thing already happens to a point in that washing machine wash efficiency ratings are only awarded on the results of the 40 degree cottons wash. The rest of the washes could be not so efficient but the washer can still get an A rating.
The White Knight “worlds first A rated tumble dryer” was also only a C rated dryer and to actually get the dryer to run at A rated efficiency you had to use a special programme (which took 8 hours) as I highlighted in my article about How energy saving claims can be misleading
Having said all that there’s the problem that if the majority of people don’t need the hot valve then the addition of the hot valve, extra programming, hoses and option buttons would increase the cost for everyone when only a minority of people want or would benefit. I still feel on balance though that washing machines nowadays should be capable of operating at their lowest efficiency costs depending on the environment they are installed in and the washing habits of the user. As you say, these days there is a demand for, “best washes at the least environmental impact”. It would be nice if washing machines could achieve this for all users and not just for the majority.
Although it is presently only a minority who have access to solar-heated water, it is a minority that is increasing and will continue to increase. Once people have installed solar panels they are not going to remove them and, with the recently introduced grants (albeit modest ones) I would envisage this rate of increase becoming greater, not less.
I’m afraid I don’t agree with Mark (post 174 above). He says, and on this I entirely agree, “provided it brings about the best washes at the least environmental impact and with due concern for any individuals particular requirements on reasonable issues such as skin complaints.” but the fact is that all of the washing machines which I have seriously looked at and taken the trouble to research do not, in most cases by their maker’s own admission, do this.
I cite as an example my own new LG Washing Machine which has the (current) top A++ Energy rating and also A wash and A spin performance. However, in the instruction manual it quite plainly states that for people with sensitive skin or allergies the use of non-bio powder should be considered and goes on to instruct users to wash with the “rinse++” and / or “MedicRinse” options selected.
Rinse++ introduces a 4th rinse, raises the water level of all 4 rinses to about 150% the water of a “normal” rinse and adds 5 minutes extra to each of the 4 rinse cycles. MedicRinse lengthens the last rinse cycle by 20 minutes and heats up the last rinse water to 30 degrees to help to release detergent.
I cannot see how anyone, including Mark, would say that this is having due concern for either the energy efficiency or the user. The machine also features a “babycare” programme which is basically a boil wash with both “Rinse++” and “MedicRinse” automatically selected and takes almost 4 hours. The instruction manual advises the use of this for Baby clothes precisely because of the risk of damage to infants’ skin through ineffectual rinsing otherwise. It would, I am quite certain, be better for the environment and the users’ electricity bill if this machine accepted hot water, had a higher level rinse as “standard” and therefore was able to rinse out the detergent faster and without heating the last rinse water.
A second example is Miele who are currently selling a machine in Germany (and probably elsewhere but not yet the UK) which does accept hot water, and also rainwater if you have a supply handy, and which, as I believe all Miele washers do, allows the user to select a “water plus” option which, depending on the consumer’s configuration, adds water at the end of the wash before the first rinse, to dilute the detergent solution and assist in draining more of it away before rinsing commences and also increases the water level of each rinse to a more “old fashioned” level in the drum.
This machine also boasts a warm last rinse if selected and again cites shifting the detergent as the reason, however a German friend of mine indicates that he instruction suggest using the warm last rinse option with lower levels of rinse water if hot fill is used, but using a higher level of rinse water and no warm rinse if you only use cold water. So far so good – this machine seems to tick all of Mark’s boxes; but why the devil is it only available in mainland Europe and not over here in the UK? The only possibly explanation that I can come up with for that is that in Germany in particular there are now much tighter rules about energy use and houses must by law (I believe from my friend) be built with a hot water supply for the washing machine – and if the law says have hot water for the machine to use clearly manufacturers will make machines that use it.
And I believe that Germany offers greater incentives to householders to install solar heating.
Mind you, I am surprised that Miele, an organisation that appears to pride itself on the quality of its goods, does not offer this hot fill machine in the UK. Another organisation whose products are revered for their quality is Rolls-Royce – and they will incorporate any modification any customer, anywhere in the world, wants in his Motor Car. (or they used to before BMW bought the Company – now I’m not sure, although, having visited the factory and talked to the people there, I get the feeling that Sir Henry Royce’s beliefs and standards are still in place at Goodwood).
I have to comment on Richard’s Rolls Royce comment. I reckon Miele would also do the same if they were able to charge the kind of prices Rolls Royce charge ;-)
I know I’ve described Miele as the Rolls Royce of washing machines but they aren’t in the same league when it comes to the wealth of their clients and the vast amount of money they can charge ;-)
I’m currently looking at buying a washing machine, and started reading this page with interest … up to the point where it became obvious that a hot&cold washing machine still heats the water (yes, I had wondered how a 90 degree wash was possible without internal heating;)).
So, if a cold-only washing machine heats water (all the time), and a hot-cold washing machine heats the water (as determined by some “rules” .. ie: sensors, time, etc) … can we assume that both types of machines heat the water with equal efficiency?
[ Keeping in mind that the hot-cold machine has some kind of a head start, regardless (to a point) of the distance from the hot-water cyclinder]
If that’s the case, then surely the hot-cold model has an advantage (in time/efficiency) due to the hot-water inlet. In my case, I live in a 1st world country where the laundry is one of the closest rooms to the hot-water cylinder (joke!), and also the hot-water tariff is cheaper than normal power.
If not, then wouldn’t it be just as feasible simply to disconnect the hot water from a hot-cold machine (where possible) and let it act as a cold-only machine? (According to the manual, the machine I’m looking at has a blanking plug included in the kit for this purpose).
To my mind, this means a hot&cold machine is capable of being either, and with less time heating water (on a more expensive tarrif) I’d expect this to be an advantage in most cases.
ie: more flexible, possibly cheaper, probably quicker.
Forgive me for skipping 3/4 of the posts, but it’s late and I don’t like washing machines *that* much!.
ps: Fisher & Paykel (.au) also make hot&cold washing machines [oops there goes my 1st-world joke ;) ], and the model I’m looking at is the WH70F60W2.
Hello marcusbrutus: I was always surprised at how many people believed their washing machine didn’t have a heating element because it had a hot valve. It was a common misconception. Even in the days of hot and cold fill when washing machines took in enough water on wash to allow a reasonable amount of hot water into the machine most washing machines only ended up with tepid water and used the heater much more than people assumed.
I can understand you not wanting to read all the comments – especially if your time stamp is accurate.
The perfect situation would be for all washing machines to have a hot and a cold valve and to let consumers decide if they want to run it as a cold fill machine or not. The hot valve could be used on essential maintenance washes or for occasional hot washes. A perfect design would also allow consumers to properly utilise their hot water if they have a free or cheap supply using thermostatically controlled fill valves and a chamber to store and reuse the initial flush of cold water than inevitably comes out of the hot pipes first.
Well I ended up getting a machine delivered today.
Long story, but result was a Fisher&Paykel WH80F60W1 for AU$5 more than the cheapest WH70F60W2 I could find (delivered). Price also included removal of THREE old machines! (WAF++;)). Total=AU$820. Price quoted was more, but by the time {WOMAN} got off the phone (she waved her magic plastic card) the sale price had dropped AU$80!!… not sure how that happened, neither is she ;). Almost a shame we don’t live about 5km further south, as we’d then be eligible for ~AU$105 rebate for having an efficient washing machine! (The 8kg is 4.5 stars vs 4 stars for the 7kg). Ah well.
I’ve tested the following so far:
Cotton 90 (initial cleaning), Cotton 40 [aka “standard test mode”] (11 towels), and Daily (approx. 7kg … FULL!).
AFAICT hot water was only used on the first two of those modes, although all were at least luke warm at some point, but it’s extremely hard to tell if or how much hot water is being used. eg: 90 degrees is HOT and makes me wonder how much power it uses. At this stage I can only hope that the hot water inlet helps.
I guess if I’m desperate to find out I’ll either have to measure the temperature of the hoses, or perhaps see how good my (infra-red) modified webcams are.
I could always try measuring an identical wash with & without the hot water connected, I suppose … we’ll see.
Either way, I feel somewhat more comfortable that hot water is available and used when necessary(?), as I _feel_ that my hot water service will be cheaper than the machine’s heater (alone) due to the lower hot-water tariff here. Totally subjective and hard to measure, I agree :|
I’m particularly interested in the HOT aspect as we’ve got another baby due in a few months. From experience I know that washing cloth nappies (yes, I came from the ark;) in only cold or warm water can result in thrush/etc even with a white-vinegar soak (the Delta 10 had a faulty hot water solenoid!).
Bottom line: she’s happy to have upgraded from my ancient Simpson Delta 10, believes that it’s going to be better/cheaper/quiter/easier/etc to use, and I’m happy not to have to work on the old monster. (Electrickery and water don’t mix!)
Thanks all for your help.
M.
ps: By “Newton’s law of cooling” using 1KW to raise the temperature from 20 to 30 degrees does not mean that you will use 1KW to raise the temperature from 30 to 40 degrees.
pps: yes, I’d think the timestamp was correct. I’m ~GMT+10, currently 2:55am. *yawn*
Hello tricia: Cold fill washing machines wash better than hot and cold fill. Having no hot valve can’t account for poor wash results. Also, the extra long time washes take now is only partially to do with a lack of hot water valve Why are wash times so Long?
Hi, further to my previous post regards power measurement I’ve had a power meter installed on my washing machine since then. I multiplied the (guess of) cost/kWh by 100 to make per-wash measurements “significant” and discovered that for an average wash (probably Cotton 40 or 60 iirc) with only cold connected that the cost was approx 6.4 cents. The exact same wash, on the exact same cycle (immediately afterward) but with the hot water connected was about 6.0 cents. The total used by the machine in ~7 weeks was about 45kWh.
Marcus.