My attention was drawn to rinsing efficiency after noticing that out of dozens of washing machines reviewed by Which? most of them had a poor rating for rinsing. Even those singled out as Best Buys were “poor” at rinsing. Believe it or not, at least one Best Buy was “very poor”. I found that pretty shocking.
From studying the figures it is clear that if “good”, or “very good” rinsing was one of the prerequisites for a Best Buy there would be no Best Buy washing machines or washer dryers at all – not a single one. It appears that Which? have decided to allow the poor rinsing results to be a caveat instead of a best buy killer. Please note however that several Which? best buys are “satisfactory” at rinsing which is something at least.
Out of 125 washing machines and washer dryers tested, a remarkable 75 of them (60%) were rated either “poor” or “very poor” at rinsing with only 3 getting the rating we should expect for all washing machines which is “good”.
The rest were a mere “satisfactory”. To summarise, just less than 3 % of the 125 washers & dryers are “good” at rinsing according to Which?
Since writing this article I’ve discovered Which? no longer give the majority of washing machines 1 or 2 star ratings for rinsing ability, and the majority appear to get 3 or 4 stars. Which? tell me they’ve readjusted their rinse marks to more accurately reflect the degrees of abilities between even poor rinsing machines. However, they are still critical of many of their rinsing abilities in the comments and the pros and cons.
What does this mean?
Well for a start it doesn’t mean that we can settle for one of the three washing machines that are “good” at rinsing because they unfortunately let themselves down in other areas such as with “noisy spin, and poor brand reliability”. However, if you really need a washing machine that rinses better than any other – maybe because of allergies – then at least Which? have identified three candidates out of the 125 they’ve tested so far.
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Why aren’t they rinsing properly and does it really matter?
Surely all washing machines should rinse well? It’s surely quite simple, you just use enough water to rinse them properly. It’s astounding that we have reached the situation where the majority of washing machines and washer dryers on sale in the UK are apparently poor at rinsing.
This has probably come about because people have been focussing on other aspects, which has left rinsing as a low priority. Two explanations spring to mind. Firstly, the focus on using less and less water is clearly impacting on our washing machine’s ability to rinse effectively. Whereas modern detergents can facilitate efficient and effective washing results at lower temperatures and with less water, no such product is currently allowing effective rinsing with much less water.
Good rinsing needs plenty of water which is in direct opposition to the current environmental concerns and clamour to be the washing machine using the least amount of water.
Eco LabelsThe second explanation I can think of is that the eco-labelling system which awards ratings for energy efficiency, spin efficiency and wash efficiency do not appear to take into account rinse efficiency.
As such, manufacturers aren’t being judged on how well their washing machines rinse, only on how well they wash and how well they extract water on spin. I’m speculating at this stage, but I can’t see how so many washing machines could be awarded an “A” wash efficiency rating if the tests took into account how well the clothes were rinsed. Presumably, as long as all stains are removed and laundry looks “clean” no one bothers about how much soap detergent residue is left.
It might be a good idea to create a fourth category, “rinse efficiency” on the eco labels, or at least include the rinse efficiency as part of the wash efficiency test.
Ultimately if customers don’t notice an issue then it could be argued that it doesn’t really matter.
Maybe it doesn’t for most people, but it surely does to anyone sensitive to wash detergents and with allergies and a lot of people are. There were 581 comments added on this topic from such people before I had to close comments to prevent it being endless.
The current situation is that to anyone keen to buy a washing machine with good rinsing I have no washing machine to recommend because none of the companies producing the best, and the most reliable washing machines currently supply one that rinses above average according to Which? although this could easily change and you would need to check out the latest to be sure.
Are Which? being too critical? Are Which? applying too stringent a rinse test? I must admit I’ve not had many complaints from people saying their washing machine isn’t rinsing properly and my own Miele washing machine, which although a Which? Best Buy, didn’t receive a “good” rating for rinsing yet it appears to rinse perfectly well as far as we can see.
In fact I remarked to my wife that my clothes don’t smell of detergent like they used to in the old washing machine and deduced that it rinsed much better. However, neither of us have any reactions to washing machine detergent. The thing about Which? is that they are totally independent.
They work only for their subscribers interests and are actually a registered charity. They don’t make any money directly by recommending any product (even though they could) because they want to be seen as 100% unbiased. They are highly respected and I expect they test products fairly. However, my understanding is that the do charge for companies to display their “Best Buy” logo!
I suspect Which? are right and that modern washing machines don’t generally rinse very well because of the reasons I speculate about above. Whether it matters or whether it will change depends on whether enough of the public are bothered, or even notice. The 581 comments added to this article below show that many people do find this a big issue.
Which? research
NOTE: Which? do rate some washing machines as satisfactory for rinsing and even a couple are rated as good, although unfortunately the few rated good (so far) are not so good on reliability.
Which? are constantly reviewing washing machines so if rinsing is particularly important to you it makes sense to become a member and see all the buying advice. I can’t print their advice for copyright reasons.
Here’s how they describe their reviews –
We are of course well known for our traditional product testing. And when we test something like the proverbial washing machine, we will ask the laboratory not only to measure how clean the clothes get, but how much water and energy is used? How easy is it to work out the programmes? What is the machine like on specialist cycles? How long does it take? All these things feed into our best buy criteria.
We will devise the testing schedule by looking at things from the ordinary user’s point of view: and if standard industry methods are not good enough we will devise our own methods ”
Causes of poor rinsing
There are some common causes of poor rinsing even in washing machines that do rinse well that it might be useful to point out. Anyone experiencing poor rinsing problems where washing comes out with detergent residues or white powder streaks should read this – White streaks or residual washing powder after washing
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Thanks for the info. Water going into the machine at 30C would help enourmously and could help with rinsing too, if hot or warm rinsing does work better than cold?
@Nikki Jenkins, when you say you can immerse something like a towel into hot water after rinsing it in cold water several times, could the residue that you see in the hot water actually be fabric conditioner? Have you tried doing this on towels and other items which have no fabric conditioner? Maybe Oliver’s comment #221 proves that having a water guzzling washing machine, with cold rinsing only, is fine?
I’m perfectly happy to run a water-guzzling cycle after the first spin that follows the main wash, without detergent, then select the final faster spin manually. I don’t care if this makes using the washing machine more expensive – you can’t put a price on health!! It’s better than wasting money on junk food, cigarrettes, too much alcohol and other things that are known to be bad for you. I’d rather not itch when I wear my clothes, use my towels, sleep in my bedding etc.
For anyone wondering: how do you “know” if the washing is properly rinsed when you take it out? If you use an unperfumed fabric conditioner like Surcare or don’t use conditioner at all, the washing should NOT smell of *anything*. “Proper” rinsing is good enough to remove the perfumes that are added to detergents (which are marketed as helping to make the clothes smell nice), but these extra perfumes irritate skin!
I believe that detergent left behind in the washing machine is causing the bad smells, grease, gunge mould and bacteria that requires monthly maintenance washes at ~95 degrees! I’m sure if a washing machine can rinse properly, it would also stop the machine from becoming filthy inside?
Interestingly, newer LG machines offer not only a Rinse+ and Rinse++ option, but also a Medic Rinse, which is an extra, deep level rinse heated to 40*C.
“Medic Rinse
Washes away detergent residue with an extra, 40-degree rinse at the end of the cycle, making it ideal for a baby’s sensitive skin.”
I still have no problems rinsing in cold water, but perhaps this LG machine would be good for those who would prefer the option. Certainly saves a lot of hassle.
Jon
I think the fact that LG have taken the trouble to add a warm rinse is confirmation that temperature is a key factor in rinsing efficiency. In the numerous tests that I have done in the past I am absolutely certain that conditioner was not involved since I was not using the stuff. I have even conducted serial tests on new towels which shows that the more they are washed the more detergent they seem to accumulate. The amount of detergent retained in clothes depends on the material. Natural fibres such as cotton are the worst. Try the test again Oliver but do it with the towels themselves. The idea of using a thermostatic valve is attractive – I will look into this but my next washing machine will be an LG!
Hi WMUser,
I can say when I was a child my Mum had a Servis Quartz 1000 (bought in 1981), which rinsed properly as did all machines of the era. She used liquid detergent on a permanant basis and 40oc washes and alot of quick washes. The machine was DISGUSTING so much so my Dad stripped at down to the last nut and bolt and scraped 3″ of slime and bacteria of the back of the drum. But it came back pretty quickly as she carried on with liquid and low temperature washes. Its only recently I have managed to change her on to bleach containg powder, and funnily enough her washing is properly clean too. I have also managed to get her to wash most things at 60oC or 75oC where applicable.
I only do a maintainence wash once a year or so, because 1-I will only use bleach containg powder Ariel or Persil (as I want clothes clean, to hell with the fading, colour detergent and liquid does not remove sweat properly) and 2- I WILL NOT wash anything below 60oC, having said that none of my clothes, even 10 year old items are that badly faded, but my machine does not wash for eons! My washing machine is spotless and does not hum at all, neither does my Mums and with the new higher water levels the machine is cleaner too, so a yearly maintainence wash for hers too will be fine. The nasty smell from washing machines is not detergent resdue it is one tough biofilm, and once there bloody hard to get rid of, the only way if it is really bad is to strip the machine down, which with some modern machines will be a challenge as they have sealled tanks. Peoples machines are only becoming filthy inside these days because we are being encouraged to wash at low temperatures and even cold water and people use liquids, liquid tabs and the inferior colour powder. Oh and just a note Ariel Excel Gel (tells you to wash at 15oC) contains NO bleach so it won’t take long to rot the washer with that stuff.
If people washed how they used to in the 70’s and 80’s with boil washes for whites and 60oC for just about everything else the maintainence wash would never have been dream’t up. If washing at 40oC does not keep the machine properly clean the it sure as hell ain’t washing you clothing properly either. Who wants to wear second hand sweat and bacteria or have a bath and dry theself on a bacteria infested towel!
Also fabric conditioner makes a strange looking type of foam, sort of thin whispy bubbles.
I can smell detergent faintly on my clothing but to say how srong it smells in the box you would think things would positivley stink of it. Now my Mums machine uses more water things do not smell strongly with detergent like they used to.
All the best,
Oliver.
Hi Oliver. It goes to show that anyone being “environmentally friendly” will actually send their washing machine to its death much sooner and require more and more washing machines to be manufactured. Not to mention the sheer amount of landfill on parts that can’t be recycled. I’m not going off topic here, but using so little water in the first place requires adding more and/or running extra cycles without detergent, the latter defeats the purpose of being environmentally friendly. Not washing hot enough will allow slime to build up – if not removed by stripping down the machine, it will rot the machine to death. The permanent bad smell will probably make people chuck the washing machine prematurely.
The health effects on allergy sufferers are not very nice, but unfortunately it’s becoming more common with “environmentally friendly” washing machines.
So I will continue using water guzzling cycles and/or adding extra rinsing water. I will be washing things at 60C or higher most of the time, unless items are too delicate. Why should my skin suffer and why should my washing machine turn into a breeding ground for bacteria through being environmentally friendly? Would these do-gooders rather see more washing machines scrapped and watch people scratch themselves bleeding, suffer more asthma attacks and so on? I would encourage everyone reading this and other messages to use plenty of water on the rinses and try to wash hot whenever possible. Your health won’t suffer and your washing machine won’t become filthy inside.
Don’t forget to complain like mad to the manufacturers of washing machines and BBC watchdog. Let’s hope Watchdog discusses this rinsing problem and its adverse health effects on television, during the next series. :)
Nikki:
I hope you don’t think I’m arguing with you :-) but I think rinsing is about removing the detergent. Dissolving it may or may not assist in that process, I don’t profess to be an expert at that level, I’m just not sure it’s essential to dissolve detergent to remove it from laundry during rinsing. Undissolved detergent is just like a bit of grit which should be removed by flushing with water.
Detergent has to be dissolved to activate and do its job of washing, but when that’s all done and rinses are being done if there’s any undissolved detergent it shouldn’t need dissolving in order to flush it out with a proper amount of cold water. I would have thought that agitation, and water being forced through the fabric should dislodge any undissolved detergent into the water solution to be pumped away as long as there’s enough water being used.
Detergent in the dispenser drawer doesn’t need to be dissolved in order to be moved from one place to another. Detergent clogs up in dispenser drawers when the cold water pressure isn’t good enough to flush it all into the drum. The same thing used to happen when detergent was placed in the hot water side of hot and cold fill washing machines if the hot water pressure wasn’t strong enough. Detergent gets wetted and pushed to the front and sides of the dispenser where it later dries and becomes firmly attached.
During the washing process detergent in laundry won’t behave in the same way because it doesn’t dry out.
If there is any detergent left in fabrics then hot water is likely to exaggerate this presence by making it foam up more, whereas cold water won’t. Foaming up any residue detergent still present in the fabric with hot or warm water doesn’t necessarily prove it’s getting the detergent out of the laundry better than cold would, it could be just highlighting it’s presence in a way that cold water doesn’t.
You may be right, I’m not saying I know one way or the other which is best for rinsing but virtually all washing machines have rinsed in cold water since they were invented and it’s only now that they are being accused of not rinsing properly since they drastically reduced the amount of water they use during the process.
The fact that a few manufacturers produced washing machines with warm rinses doesn’t convince me that warm rinsing is better because manufacturers have a long track record of conning the public with pseudo science and all sorts of claims. I think if any manufacturer comes up with anything that’s genuinely better then all other manufacturers follow suit and it becomes standard.
I still think it’s possible warm water rinsing may offer some benefits but using a lot more hot water during the wash process is the polar opposite of what most manufacturers and customers currently want, and if warm water rinsing is substantially better than cold water rinsing it’s amazing that after nearly 100 years of washing machine advancement and one-upmanship amongst competing manufacturers they virtually all stuck with cold water rinsing.
Oliver:
As far as I’m aware you are supposed to. The detergent is purposely perfumed because a lot of people apparently like the laundry to have a light perfumed smell after washing.
Maybe that’s the problem? I wonder if manufacturers are in cahoots with detergent manufacturers to deliberately not rinse too thoroughly to allow the laundry to retain the detergent manufacturers “pleasant” smell? ;-P
Hi Nikki,
I have repeated the test with a towel, washed using a normal dose of Persil powder (not underdosed) on a 60oC cycle and part of a FULL load of towels, no fabric conditioner. Once again nothing came out, no bubbles and the water was crystal clear. I used hot water for the test and still it remained free from any detergent.
Oliver.
Hi Andy,
Laundry detergent smells stronger now than they ever has done.
On the side of a box of Ariel it says……..”For an extra burst of freshness on your favorite items add an extra 70ml and smell the difference”.
So by adding extra Ariel rinsing will be done to a worse standard, it could block up the machine as there will be far too much powder in there in the first place and sensitive skin will suffer. The extra 70ml is not for cleaning just for smell, what a down right waste.
Back when I was born in the late 1980’s laundry detergents just smelt of a clean soft smell, todays detergents are just awful, the perfume is far too strong, it almost bits your nose off. My laundry only smells a little of Persil as the Bosch rinses very well, that proves it rinses well when you smell whats in the box as it were.
I don’t know if this is just me but when you walk down the street or at work some people positivley stink of laundry detergent/fabric conditioner, everywhere you go you can smell soap powder, so people are either adding too much or they have modern washing machines that do not rinse properly. Must be the new trend to smell like Persil! Who wants to be coated in the ingredients of soap powder on a permanent basis?
I personally do not like the smell at all and would happily use a stink free washing powder if it cleaned as well as Ariel or Persil and kept the machine clean of course.
Oliver.
Hi WMUser,
You got the environmental bit spot on.
There are environmental issues out there, but washing in cold/cool water will only make things worse as we both know a hell of alot more landfill for a start, washing machines are not small appliances.
But consider the following,
1-If washing is not cleaned properly in cool/cold water the clothing will be rewashed. Unnessarcary waste of water, detergent etc.
2- The clothing you are wearing is not properly clean, wearing second hand sweat ond dirt, not pleasent.
3-More landfill, not just from machines but all the drum spiders and everything else that have to be changed unnessercerily. More waste.
4-Towels smell after one use, some so bad just getting them wet will make them smell, more washing as people believe they are dirty, washed correctly they should do 3-4 days or so without smelling. More unnessercary laundry.
Just a few reasons why washing at low temperatures is only a short term energy saving and does not out weigh the serious consiquesces that will follow after a few months of trying to be “environmentally friendly”.
Washing at high temperatures, the machine will last a lot longer, will not be breeding or smelling, clothing will last longer as it is not being discarded as stains supposably will not come out etc.
If anyone wants to help the environment washing at 30oC or what ever is just a plain con as are alot of environmental issues. Somethings are an excellent idea such as recycling. But what we as a country are doing to supposably help the environment is not out weighing the fact things don’t last very long, nobody repairs anything and we a a throw away society. The amount of landfill these days is absoulutley outragious, quite a big percentage of what goes in still works, people are either bored of it or want the latest in the way of gadgets and gizmos etc.
Oliver.