My attention was drawn to rinsing efficiency after noticing that out of dozens of washing machines reviewed by Which? most of them had a poor rating for rinsing. Even those singled out as Best Buys were “poor” at rinsing. Believe it or not, at least one Best Buy was “very poor”. I found that pretty shocking.
From studying the figures it is clear that if “good”, or “very good” rinsing was one of the prerequisites for a Best Buy there would be no Best Buy washing machines or washer dryers at all – not a single one. It appears that Which? have decided to allow the poor rinsing results to be a caveat instead of a best buy killer. Please note however that several Which? best buys are “satisfactory” at rinsing which is something at least.
Out of 125 washing machines and washer dryers tested, a remarkable 75 of them (60%) were rated either “poor” or “very poor” at rinsing with only 3 getting the rating we should expect for all washing machines which is “good”.
The rest were a mere “satisfactory”. To summarise, just less than 3 % of the 125 washers & dryers are “good” at rinsing according to Which?
Since writing this article I’ve discovered Which? no longer give the majority of washing machines 1 or 2 star ratings for rinsing ability, and the majority appear to get 3 or 4 stars. Which? tell me they’ve readjusted their rinse marks to more accurately reflect the degrees of abilities between even poor rinsing machines. However, they are still critical of many of their rinsing abilities in the comments and the pros and cons.
What does this mean?
Well for a start it doesn’t mean that we can settle for one of the three washing machines that are “good” at rinsing because they unfortunately let themselves down in other areas such as with “noisy spin, and poor brand reliability”. However, if you really need a washing machine that rinses better than any other – maybe because of allergies – then at least Which? have identified three candidates out of the 125 they’ve tested so far.
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Why aren’t they rinsing properly and does it really matter?
Surely all washing machines should rinse well? It’s surely quite simple, you just use enough water to rinse them properly. It’s astounding that we have reached the situation where the majority of washing machines and washer dryers on sale in the UK are apparently poor at rinsing.
This has probably come about because people have been focussing on other aspects, which has left rinsing as a low priority. Two explanations spring to mind. Firstly, the focus on using less and less water is clearly impacting on our washing machine’s ability to rinse effectively. Whereas modern detergents can facilitate efficient and effective washing results at lower temperatures and with less water, no such product is currently allowing effective rinsing with much less water.
Good rinsing needs plenty of water which is in direct opposition to the current environmental concerns and clamour to be the washing machine using the least amount of water.
Eco LabelsThe second explanation I can think of is that the eco-labelling system which awards ratings for energy efficiency, spin efficiency and wash efficiency do not appear to take into account rinse efficiency.
As such, manufacturers aren’t being judged on how well their washing machines rinse, only on how well they wash and how well they extract water on spin. I’m speculating at this stage, but I can’t see how so many washing machines could be awarded an “A” wash efficiency rating if the tests took into account how well the clothes were rinsed. Presumably, as long as all stains are removed and laundry looks “clean” no one bothers about how much soap detergent residue is left.
It might be a good idea to create a fourth category, “rinse efficiency” on the eco labels, or at least include the rinse efficiency as part of the wash efficiency test.
Ultimately if customers don’t notice an issue then it could be argued that it doesn’t really matter.
Maybe it doesn’t for most people, but it surely does to anyone sensitive to wash detergents and with allergies and a lot of people are. There were 581 comments added on this topic from such people before I had to close comments to prevent it being endless.
The current situation is that to anyone keen to buy a washing machine with good rinsing I have no washing machine to recommend because none of the companies producing the best, and the most reliable washing machines currently supply one that rinses above average according to Which? although this could easily change and you would need to check out the latest to be sure.
Are Which? being too critical? Are Which? applying too stringent a rinse test? I must admit I’ve not had many complaints from people saying their washing machine isn’t rinsing properly and my own Miele washing machine, which although a Which? Best Buy, didn’t receive a “good” rating for rinsing yet it appears to rinse perfectly well as far as we can see.
In fact I remarked to my wife that my clothes don’t smell of detergent like they used to in the old washing machine and deduced that it rinsed much better. However, neither of us have any reactions to washing machine detergent. The thing about Which? is that they are totally independent.
They work only for their subscribers interests and are actually a registered charity. They don’t make any money directly by recommending any product (even though they could) because they want to be seen as 100% unbiased. They are highly respected and I expect they test products fairly. However, my understanding is that the do charge for companies to display their “Best Buy” logo!
I suspect Which? are right and that modern washing machines don’t generally rinse very well because of the reasons I speculate about above. Whether it matters or whether it will change depends on whether enough of the public are bothered, or even notice. The 581 comments added to this article below show that many people do find this a big issue.
Which? research
NOTE: Which? do rate some washing machines as satisfactory for rinsing and even a couple are rated as good, although unfortunately the few rated good (so far) are not so good on reliability.
Which? are constantly reviewing washing machines so if rinsing is particularly important to you it makes sense to become a member and see all the buying advice. I can’t print their advice for copyright reasons.
Here’s how they describe their reviews –
We are of course well known for our traditional product testing. And when we test something like the proverbial washing machine, we will ask the laboratory not only to measure how clean the clothes get, but how much water and energy is used? How easy is it to work out the programmes? What is the machine like on specialist cycles? How long does it take? All these things feed into our best buy criteria.
We will devise the testing schedule by looking at things from the ordinary user’s point of view: and if standard industry methods are not good enough we will devise our own methods ”
Causes of poor rinsing
There are some common causes of poor rinsing even in washing machines that do rinse well that it might be useful to point out. Anyone experiencing poor rinsing problems where washing comes out with detergent residues or white powder streaks should read this – White streaks or residual washing powder after washing
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I’ve become sick and tired of re-rinsing, pausing the washing machine and adding jugfuls of warm water to get rid of the detergent and its nasty chemicals. I’ve decided I will try making my own detergent using 4 packets of “safer” cleaning products, which claim not to have all the nasties that irritate skin. If it works and cleans well, I will stop doing the tedious extra rinses and see if I don’t get skin irritation from these “kinder” products. In the meantime there is still some Ariel detergents I need to use up, when I’m around to perform the re-rinsing.
I’ve provided a link to the “how to” video (apologies if I added it before, I can’t remember). Basically the 4 ingredients consist of these being added into a tall plastic container, a lid put on and shaking the mixture well:
_
Soda Crystals (aka “Washing Soda”)
Borax substitute
2 tablespoons of Soap Flakes (use liquid soap flakes for washes below 40C)
2 tablespoons of Oxygen Bleach powder
_
I will make 2 containers of this mixture: one will have the oxygen bleach for whites (and pale colours) and the other will not have the oxygen bleach and will be used for coloured laundry. This concoction will be added to the drum to avoid the soap drawer getting mucky. I will use about half a mug of it on full loads and much less for small loads and “tweak” the amount needed according to: load size, water hardness and level of soiling.
If you can’t find all these 4 products in the supermarket, you can order them online and it may work out cheaper if you buy them in bulk?
I see others are having the same problems with modern detergents foaming too much. I think baby oil is a good anti-foaming agent? Maybe worth trying a small amount to see if it stops the foaming. The detergent should remove the baby oil (soda crystals and detergent definitely will!). Remember that very small loads need just 1/3 of the MINIMUM recommended amount of the detergent to stop the excess foam. Full loads don’t cause foaming if the detergent dosage is correct.
I will try making my own “washing powder” with the 4 products and let you know how I get on. I hope it cleans well and saves me having to spend time manually re-rinsing and tipping jugfuls of warm water into the machine via the soap drawer. It’s really annoying having to do this; granted, it doesn’t take up much time to add the extra water, but it’s still VERY annoying and it takes longer to finish each washload because of the extra rinses being performed.
I hope the next series of BBC Watchdog investigates modern washing machines which don’t rinse properly and the health problems it causes! Thanks for opening this blog again.
Hi Gemma, Barbara and WMuser,
I can confirm that the main reason these days why detergents foam too much is because 1: they are not soap based and have as little as 5% soap 2: poor anti foaming agents.
Bruce at Dripak Uk told me this and was very helpful. He suggested adding a teaspoon of liquid soap flakes to the wash and that would kill the bubbles and it works!
However i have found by pure accident that the new Persil small and mighty capsules do not overfoam at all. Ok there is suds but they collapse and don’t get higher so i am sticking to these now. The Persil colour capsules contain 15-30% soap so perhaps thats why they work. I have very little residue if any with these so perhaps worth a try? The Waitrose Sensitive liquid in 1.5 litre bottle is actually Surcare and has good anti foaming control too, the woman in Waitrose said it was a common problem!!
Best Wishes
Ben
I meant to add that i put one capsule of small and mighty in a 90 degree wash with no clothes and no overfoaming occurred at all. If i was to use powder or tablets or a heavily detergent based liquid even as little as 10ml the foam would reach as high as the top of the drum and poor out on the floor through the soap dispenser. And this would then acitivate the foam sensor.
Ben
Thanks for that info Ben am so tired of these washing machine and if this site is any thing to go by we are one of many too. i will go buy these two products ,can you tell me the brand of the liquid soap flakes please and how many mL does the capsule hold.
I have also been adding Arms & Hammer baking soda to the Towels last rinse .
Friday I went down to the Miele centre to look at the w5740 and watched a load of washing go round and when I pointed out the soap left in the last rinse before softener added and you will laugh at this,she said the water is cloudy because it leave a film on the clothes, that is what makes them smell nice.
And here is stupid me washing for only the last 30yrs wasting my time trying to rinse it out.
Gemma
Hi Gemma: Someone commented a long time back, right at the beginning of this topic, that the lack of totally clear water isn’t a reliable indicator of the presence of detergent. Modern detergents are designed to leave laundry smelling and most people presumably like it. Therefore washing machines will not completely remove all traces of it in order for a specific fragrance to be left behind so Mile’s explanation may be correct.
Hi Gemma,
The liquid soap flakes is made by Dri-Pak and is sold in Waitrose and Tesco’s but you can order it from Dr-pak themselves or through their Ebay outlet.
Regarding the Persil capsules they are pre-measured doses that hold 40ml but they rinse perfectly and there is no need to add soap to these including Ariel, Bold, Daz, Fairy or supermarket own brand liqui-tabs as all contain 15-30% soap. You can check yourself by looking at the product ingredients on Tesco or Sainsbury’s website.
I assume that the detergent companies took the soap content out because the general public like to see loads of foam and soap as i have gladly found ‘kills’ suds.
By the way if you use any other form of detergent i.e. liquid or powder i would suggest just adding 1 capful of liquid soap flakes. This is far easier than making your own and not time consuming.
Hope you find that helps as it does work for me.
Ben
P.S. Gemma i don’t know if your allergic to optical brighteners but no amount of re-rinsing will rid them as they make a permanent bond to the clothes and then constantly touch the skin causing irritation. A lot of people buy non-bio thinking its the enzymes when more often than not its the brighteners and perfumes. I gave up optical brighteners and no longer have ezcema. Hope that helps?
Today I added 2 capfuls of baby oil to the drum before loading the towels (only towels) and to my surprise there was no foaming. None whatsoever! To make sure the baby oil would mix with the detergent, I poured the 2 capfuls (yes it’s a small cap) of the baby oil next to a drum paddle so it wouldn’t dribble down the holes in the drum.
I don’t know if this will harm the washing machine or clothes, but I’m so impressed that I had NO FOAM AT ALL! Without the baby oil, any amount of detergent, even 1/3 of the minimum recommended amount will cause foaming with towels, which gets worse as the water temperature reaches 60C, the usual temperature I use for washing towels on their own.
The towels look perfectly washed and there’s no smell. I’m using up the last of the detergents I already have, so I will be using baby oil every time. Why can’t the detergent manufacturers use proper anti-foaming agents? Baby oil stops the foaming; I hope it doesn’t harm the laundry and the washing machine! I’ve yet to try this with soda crystals, but will do so next time. The baby oil seems to REALLY improve rinsing too because without the baby oil the rinsing water would be opaque and have foam bubbles, which never seem to go away.
The home-made mixture I will make will use liquid soap flakes, which could help stop the foam? Do people really need to see foam in a washing machine? Can’t the detergent manufacturers make a non foaming detergent and convince the public that it never creates masses of foam that’s almost impossible to rinse off? As for clothes smelling nice, the perfumes which produce that nice smell also cause nasty skin reactions! The smell is added because people like it and the nice smell can be used in marketing to increase sales and profit.
Quote from Ben:
I’ve never seen anywhere near that amount of oversudsing using proper detergent designed for automatic washing machines. Is your water incredibly soft, is it artificially softened? The only time I’ve seen foam coming out like that is when someone’s put washing up liquid in the machine, or used twin tub detergent instead of front loading washing machine detergent.
I’ve had exactly the same problem with detergents foaming too much and coming over the top of the door glass. Powders, liquids and just about every type of laundry detergent can foam too much if you wash a very small load or in my case, wash only towels. I have always used detergent for front loading washing machines and I’ve never used twin tub or hand-wash detergent. This foaming problem is more prevalent now and I have no idea why, but I guess it’s because the detergent manufacturers are cutting costs and reducing the amount or type of anti-foaming agents which are meant to stop the excess foam. I’ve proven that you can prevent this from happening in the first place by adding 2 cupfuls of baby oil to the load it’s really that easy! I find it appalling that the manufacturers will charge the same amount of money for the detergent but not care about the excess foaming problem!
I’m pleased to say that the home-made mixture DOES work and you won’t get any foaming at all provided you use LIQUID soap flakes instead of the standard soap flakes; the standard (non-liquid) soap flakes will generate lots of foam very quickly! I’ve only tried this home-made stuff once and apparently it softens the clothes, so you save money on not buying fabric conditioner. I will keep using it and see how I get on. There’s normal detergents I’ve nearly used up and now I know baby oil will stop the foaming.
@ washerhelp yes its artificially softened and no it isn’t my water softener! Its modern detergents and lack of good quality anti-foam! I have had the water softner for over 12 years and never had a problem before. Since using capsules which have a high soap content i don’t get foaming issues anymore nor if i add a capful of liquid soap flakes to Persil powder. I no longer use powders or tablets because of the unnecessary bulking agents and fillers they put in. Instead i use a detergent and limescale remover once a month at 90 degrees. I don’t have many whites anyway so no need to have bleach powder and i can’t use it anyway because of the reaction i have to optical brighteners.