My attention was drawn to rinsing efficiency after noticing that out of dozens of washing machines reviewed by Which? most of them had a poor rating for rinsing. Even those singled out as Best Buys were “poor” at rinsing. Believe it or not, at least one Best Buy was “very poor”. I found that pretty shocking.
From studying the figures it is clear that if “good”, or “very good” rinsing was one of the prerequisites for a Best Buy there would be no Best Buy washing machines or washer dryers at all – not a single one. It appears that Which? have decided to allow the poor rinsing results to be a caveat instead of a best buy killer. Please note however that several Which? best buys are “satisfactory” at rinsing which is something at least.
Out of 125 washing machines and washer dryers tested, a remarkable 75 of them (60%) were rated either “poor” or “very poor” at rinsing with only 3 getting the rating we should expect for all washing machines which is “good”.
The rest were a mere “satisfactory”. To summarise, just less than 3 % of the 125 washers & dryers are “good” at rinsing according to Which?
Since writing this article I’ve discovered Which? no longer give the majority of washing machines 1 or 2 star ratings for rinsing ability, and the majority appear to get 3 or 4 stars. Which? tell me they’ve readjusted their rinse marks to more accurately reflect the degrees of abilities between even poor rinsing machines. However, they are still critical of many of their rinsing abilities in the comments and the pros and cons.
What does this mean?
Well for a start it doesn’t mean that we can settle for one of the three washing machines that are “good” at rinsing because they unfortunately let themselves down in other areas such as with “noisy spin, and poor brand reliability”. However, if you really need a washing machine that rinses better than any other – maybe because of allergies – then at least Which? have identified three candidates out of the 125 they’ve tested so far.
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Why aren’t they rinsing properly and does it really matter?
Surely all washing machines should rinse well? It’s surely quite simple, you just use enough water to rinse them properly. It’s astounding that we have reached the situation where the majority of washing machines and washer dryers on sale in the UK are apparently poor at rinsing.
This has probably come about because people have been focussing on other aspects, which has left rinsing as a low priority. Two explanations spring to mind. Firstly, the focus on using less and less water is clearly impacting on our washing machine’s ability to rinse effectively. Whereas modern detergents can facilitate efficient and effective washing results at lower temperatures and with less water, no such product is currently allowing effective rinsing with much less water.
Good rinsing needs plenty of water which is in direct opposition to the current environmental concerns and clamour to be the washing machine using the least amount of water.
Eco LabelsThe second explanation I can think of is that the eco-labelling system which awards ratings for energy efficiency, spin efficiency and wash efficiency do not appear to take into account rinse efficiency.
As such, manufacturers aren’t being judged on how well their washing machines rinse, only on how well they wash and how well they extract water on spin. I’m speculating at this stage, but I can’t see how so many washing machines could be awarded an “A” wash efficiency rating if the tests took into account how well the clothes were rinsed. Presumably, as long as all stains are removed and laundry looks “clean” no one bothers about how much soap detergent residue is left.
It might be a good idea to create a fourth category, “rinse efficiency” on the eco labels, or at least include the rinse efficiency as part of the wash efficiency test.
Ultimately if customers don’t notice an issue then it could be argued that it doesn’t really matter.
Maybe it doesn’t for most people, but it surely does to anyone sensitive to wash detergents and with allergies and a lot of people are. There were 581 comments added on this topic from such people before I had to close comments to prevent it being endless.
The current situation is that to anyone keen to buy a washing machine with good rinsing I have no washing machine to recommend because none of the companies producing the best, and the most reliable washing machines currently supply one that rinses above average according to Which? although this could easily change and you would need to check out the latest to be sure.
Are Which? being too critical? Are Which? applying too stringent a rinse test? I must admit I’ve not had many complaints from people saying their washing machine isn’t rinsing properly and my own Miele washing machine, which although a Which? Best Buy, didn’t receive a “good” rating for rinsing yet it appears to rinse perfectly well as far as we can see.
In fact I remarked to my wife that my clothes don’t smell of detergent like they used to in the old washing machine and deduced that it rinsed much better. However, neither of us have any reactions to washing machine detergent. The thing about Which? is that they are totally independent.
They work only for their subscribers interests and are actually a registered charity. They don’t make any money directly by recommending any product (even though they could) because they want to be seen as 100% unbiased. They are highly respected and I expect they test products fairly. However, my understanding is that the do charge for companies to display their “Best Buy” logo!
I suspect Which? are right and that modern washing machines don’t generally rinse very well because of the reasons I speculate about above. Whether it matters or whether it will change depends on whether enough of the public are bothered, or even notice. The 581 comments added to this article below show that many people do find this a big issue.
Which? research
NOTE: Which? do rate some washing machines as satisfactory for rinsing and even a couple are rated as good, although unfortunately the few rated good (so far) are not so good on reliability.
Which? are constantly reviewing washing machines so if rinsing is particularly important to you it makes sense to become a member and see all the buying advice. I can’t print their advice for copyright reasons.
Here’s how they describe their reviews –
We are of course well known for our traditional product testing. And when we test something like the proverbial washing machine, we will ask the laboratory not only to measure how clean the clothes get, but how much water and energy is used? How easy is it to work out the programmes? What is the machine like on specialist cycles? How long does it take? All these things feed into our best buy criteria.
We will devise the testing schedule by looking at things from the ordinary user’s point of view: and if standard industry methods are not good enough we will devise our own methods ”
Causes of poor rinsing
There are some common causes of poor rinsing even in washing machines that do rinse well that it might be useful to point out. Anyone experiencing poor rinsing problems where washing comes out with detergent residues or white powder streaks should read this – White streaks or residual washing powder after washing
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I wash everything I wear or sleep on in hot water, with a warm water rinse. Then, after the wash cycle is over, I run the machine again with the same load, but without putting in detergent. I have a small sign that I made to remind me whether a particular load is due for a rinse cycle, or is ready to put into the dryer.
I have quite severe problems with any new clothing or sheets. If something has no apparent chemical odor, it is washed three times in a row. If it has an apparent chemical odor (especially as it is damp after a wash cycle), then it gets washed until the chemical odor is gone. I have sometimes washed items three dozen times without being able to remove the chemical odor.
The biggest problems appear to be with any clothing item that is marked “wash in cold water.” From my research, it appears that anything destined for a cold water wash has been treated with an anti-microbial surface finish. The anti-microbial finish reacts with body debris (sweat, skin particles) and prevents them from causing odors. However, some lucky people have this coating react with their skin, causing rashes and irritation.
I have tried using milk, bleach, ammonia, washing soda, and vinegar (not at the same time) to remove this finish from clothes. Nothing seems to work. Well, OK, the bleach made some t-shirts look like they been tie-dyed. They still itch when I wear them, though.
Modern life was supposed to lift us up above the savages groveling in the dirt and muck. Our political correctness (cold water, less water, shorter machine cycles to save energy) have just thrown us back into the dirt and muck.
Regarding your last paragraph WMUser, I agree, and I’ve said the same to Which? and await their reply. I cannot understand how any washing machine that is not very good at rinsing could possibly be a Best Buy. Maybe they don’t think rinsing is a big issue, but if so why single it out as a category to be marked?
Maybe they think if a washing machine is not very good at rinsing there aren’t any real consequences, but many comments on this article show that there are very real consequences, at least for some.
hi all.
I have now fixed my washing problem, the cause being washing powder which has changed to a stronger mix because it now has to wash at low temps but no longer rinses out as to the lack of water used in a new machine about 45lt in a normal wash and you now have to add water softener when you did not have to before.
So after about a year of doing tests , i have found that washing powder and liquids no longer do what they did before thats (wash and rinse out without manual intervention by adding extra water ;eg rewash) With my new washing machine i have found that you must now add extra water or do a rewash , which is the case now.
The new type of washing machines are no good now as people are finding out now as the water used is not right amount to do the job ; (wash and rinse the dirt ,lime or limescale which ever you want to call it from your clothes.
I now believe that new washing machines and washing powder / liquid is no longer fit to do the job as before .
As for washer help comment in 364 please read what you wrote then have a look at my first comment 335 on this site , i did give the levels of washing powder i was using etc ,and also i wrote that new washing machines would not wash and rinse only using 45lt of water , i did think you would know from this that i had a new washing machine!!! .so did not read my comment then? that is not aggression just a fact.
When you write in a comment that you have done everything i did think that people would know what i was doing , thats not over loading, correct amount of washing powder and using washing machine in a normal way ,stupid me? and i was having a problem after my powder had been changed to concentrated .
There are many products manufactured which do not work and they have cost a great deal of money and marketed as a good product ,so yes a product can be for sale and it does not do the job it was made to do.
By the way makers will swear until they are blue in the face that the product they make is good ,and it is only on sites like this that you find out about products which are no good .
BECAUSE WE TEST THEM IN NORMAL USE !.
ADY.
@Nikki Jenkins, I agree with what you say:
I understand your frustration. I wish washing machines were truly-automatic and you could simply load it with the laundry, detergent and fabric conditioner, switch on and come back to it later with perfectly clean and perfectly rinsed washing. No modern washing machine will rinse properly, even if people activate the-extra rinse option every time (or other name given to-extra rinse by each manufacturer).
I don’t like giving out advice, but in this case I feel it’s relevant. As an eczema sufferer, I’ve been able to cure it by making sure all soaps, shower gels and shampoo are thoroughly rinsed away, wear gloves when cleaning and making sure the washing is rinsed properly. I’ve tried many ways to rinse the washing properly, as mentioned further up in several comments of mine and the only one I find works best is 1/2 a drum of WARM water when re-rinsing. It may be very hard for people to accept, but you can ONLY rinse properly by re-rising and manually adding jug after jug of HOT water to raise the water level high in the washing machine.
To save rinsing your washing by hand Nikki, maybe you could copy my method? I now have my hot water set at 80C (very hot I know and could scald!!) and have to switch my hot water on and off once a day to avoid a higher gas bill! When re-rising, I select the quick-wash, the highest spin speed (1600 is default on the cottons quick wash on my machine) and pause the washing machine when it has stopped filling with the cold water. Now I put a large jug in the kitchen sink, fill it up with this hot water and pour it into the soap drawer again and again until I have 1/2 a drum of warm water. 80C may sound too hot, but by the time it mixes with the cold water already in the washing machine, it cools down rapidly. The porthole door glass feels warm to the touch, but not hot. DOING THIS REALLY WORKS!! Once the water level is 1/2 way up the door, I un-pause and watch with horror as the soapsuds fizz out of the clothes as the drum rotates.
If anyone copies my method, please DON’T even think about trying it if you have anything delicate in the wash like a silk item that may shrink. This method is really for cotton and polyester items. It works so well, that the water in the last rinse (when re-rinsing) with the softener added is CLEAR!
Nikki, I don’t know if your washing machine is near a hot tap, but if it is, copying this method may save you a lot of time compared to rinsing the laundry by hand. Let the washing machine do the hard work. :)
Finally, I always load each item of laundry one by one LOOSELY. I know it’s tempting to grab lots of washing at once and push it into the drum, but it will be washed and rinsed better and won’t crease as much if loosely loaded and making sure there’s a gap of about 6 between the top of the washing and the top of the drum for a full load. Bulky items like jackets are best loaded no more than 2/3 the drum height.
Hope that helps.
Hi Nikki, there’s no stigma attached to being allergic ;-) People commonly become allergic to something they’ve been exposed to all their life without previous problems. People can suddenly become allergic to peanuts as adults when they’ve previously eaten thousands of them, or become allergic to their pet they’ve had for years, or suddenly develop intolerance to foods they’ve always eaten – or detergents. You keep emphasising you are not allergic but then describe how you have allergic reactions to detergent and how your skin cannot tolerate undiluted detergent. I can’t see how an intolerance to detergent in washed laundry could be anything other than an allergic reaction. It doesn’t mean it’s your fault :-)
It is not only the fact modern washing machines do not rinse properly but they do not spin at high enough speed on the spins between the rinses to get all the soap out. I have bought an old Hotpoint 9506 electronic de luxe and it gets all the soap out and only takes 55-60 minutes to do a 60 degrees wash and 4 rinses with water 1/3 up the door glass on washes and rinses. No residue left at all though you can faintly smell some fragrance but perfumes these days seem to survive rinsing no matter how much water is used. But i have plunged towels in hot water after rinsing in the Hotpoint and absolutely no residue using Persil, Ariel, Daz, Bold or Fairy. I can use conventional powders, liquids etc and they do not over foam at all.
I believe the powders/liquids over foam in these stupid pathetic attempts of modern machines is because the detergent doesn’t have enough water to mix with and there its mainly washing in neat detergent where as the older models ‘water it down’ with extra water they use in the wash process. I will say this that i think the detergents made of all brands back in the 80’s and 90’s were way better than what we have now including powders. Washing at 30 degrees is a gimmick and only useful for freshening clothes but as usual the ‘so called environmental brigade’ think they know best when they haven’t got a clue!
Don’t know if anyone has tried but next time you go into Currys, Comet or Bennetts and complain about the rubbish rinsing of modern machines you just get fobbed off with ‘They are excellent at rinsing’, ‘They are energy efficient’, ‘Better for the environment’. One man told me in an independant store said that modern machines were better at rinsing lol I felt like wacking him one lol Neither the retailers or manufacturers want to know and its down to individuals to pressurise and demand better machines!
Hope all that helps.
Simon
I am not saying there is a stigma !! The point I am trying to make is that I am not allergic to anything, apart from monosodium glutamate, and it is highly irritating to be told that the problem with modern washing machines not rinsing properly is somehow my fault !! It is not, it is because they do not allow hot water rinses, that is the end of it. If anybody rubbed in dissolved biological washing powder or liquid into their skin they would develop an allergic reaction. When you wear clothes that have not been properly rinsed, when you sweat your sweat “breaks” down the soap residue in your clothes and causes sore, itchy skin. This is NOT an allergy !!
WM User : you are preaching to the converted !! A long time ago … if you wade back to the beginning of this thread … you will see that I used to pour hot water into my washing machine to rinse my laundry! Unfortunately, doing this damaged my last machine which was a bosch, and my latest washing machine, a Miele, knackered its bearings because of the weight of the extra water. My husband had to strip it right down to a pile of parts to replace the bearings on the drum, very cleverly I thought because Miele told him he wouldn’t be able to do it … but he did. I have been banned now from filling it up too much, although there is in fact a water sensor on it to prevent this happening (we did actually have this removed, but it still will only allow you to fill half way up the window).
@Nikki Jenkins, I’m sure that bearings will fail on every washing machine at some point, they always do. I wonder if bearings on modern washing machines are stronger for 3 reasons: 1) Washing machine drums are bigger and typically wash 7KG or more at once 2) Modern washing machines claim to be capable of washing duvets. You can imagine how heavy a soaking wet duvet is!! 3) Faster spin speeds are available now, such as 1600rpm or higher. “Washerhelp” would know more about bearings and roughly how long they last. I don’t know how old your Miele is?
Maybe you could fill the drum 1/3 with hot water, instead of 1/2 and see how that goes? Perhaps 2 of the rinses in 1/3 of hot water may work? Hopefully nothing will come out ruined, but it should be ok if everything is cotton e.g. towels, jeans etc. The water going in must be hot as it cools down instantly when it hits the cold water and the inside of the washing machine.
Hi WMUser,
Bearings have actually decreased in size as manufacturers are cost cutting, it is not uncommon for a washing machine to have collapsed bearings within 18 months. Higher spin speeds, larger load sizes and taking into account for overloading mean the need for decent sized bearings, the majority of manufacturers refuse to upgrade bearings on their large capacity machines and those with high spin speeds.
Incidentally adding water will have very little effect on bearings simply because the water is held by the tank (outer drum) so the suspension system and springs will suffer. Overloading, over dosing the detergent and also under-dosing the detergent are all detrimental though, the latter two will rot the water seal and thus the bearings get wet and rust though and break up or collapse.
Having repaired a few machines in my time I can tell you My Mums IAR Siltal (nearly 10 years old), a low spin, short cycled machine, 5kg capacity machine has bearings of exactly twice the size on a current Merloni or Electrolux group produced machine both of which will have large load capacities, long cycles and also ridiculously fast spin speeds. My 16 year old Bosch has bearings the same size as the IAR Siltal, however current Bosch machines have much smaller bearings and in the budget end (WAA range) it is not uncommon for failures in 18 months.
Miele and Asko use the best bearings currently on the market today, all the other manufacturers are pandering to what people want, cheap throwaway machines.
And finally a wet thin summer double duvet is not as heavy as a 7kg load of wet towels!
Oliver.
Hi Simon,
Thats an excellent choice of old machine to buy, very good quality and there are still plently of parts available to keep it running too.
Like your Hotpoint my Bosch does 4 rinses 1/3 up the door, and can faintly smell Persil, but when I plunge towels into hot water it remains clear and free from any soap residue.
I have complained in the likes of Comet and Currys etc. and they told me the same bullsh1t as well, all their washing machines rinsed properly and they could not understand what I was complaining about, in fact they were most patronising, I told them where to go and then walked up to the Washer Shop and bought my Bosch. Incedentally the Washer Shop knew exactly what I mean’t and were very helpful, still are today, but it is a privately owned shop and has been going since the year dot.
All the Best,
Oliver.