My attention was drawn to rinsing efficiency after noticing that out of dozens of washing machines reviewed by Which? most of them had a poor rating for rinsing. Even those singled out as Best Buys were “poor” at rinsing. Believe it or not, at least one Best Buy was “very poor”. I found that pretty shocking.
From studying the figures it is clear that if “good”, or “very good” rinsing was one of the prerequisites for a Best Buy there would be no Best Buy washing machines or washer dryers at all – not a single one. It appears that Which? have decided to allow the poor rinsing results to be a caveat instead of a best buy killer. Please note however that several Which? best buys are “satisfactory” at rinsing which is something at least.
Out of 125 washing machines and washer dryers tested, a remarkable 75 of them (60%) were rated either “poor” or “very poor” at rinsing with only 3 getting the rating we should expect for all washing machines which is “good”.
The rest were a mere “satisfactory”. To summarise, just less than 3 % of the 125 washers & dryers are “good” at rinsing according to Which?
Since writing this article I’ve discovered Which? no longer give the majority of washing machines 1 or 2 star ratings for rinsing ability, and the majority appear to get 3 or 4 stars. Which? tell me they’ve readjusted their rinse marks to more accurately reflect the degrees of abilities between even poor rinsing machines. However, they are still critical of many of their rinsing abilities in the comments and the pros and cons.
What does this mean?
Well for a start it doesn’t mean that we can settle for one of the three washing machines that are “good” at rinsing because they unfortunately let themselves down in other areas such as with “noisy spin, and poor brand reliability”. However, if you really need a washing machine that rinses better than any other – maybe because of allergies – then at least Which? have identified three candidates out of the 125 they’ve tested so far.
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Why aren’t they rinsing properly and does it really matter?
Surely all washing machines should rinse well? It’s surely quite simple, you just use enough water to rinse them properly. It’s astounding that we have reached the situation where the majority of washing machines and washer dryers on sale in the UK are apparently poor at rinsing.
This has probably come about because people have been focussing on other aspects, which has left rinsing as a low priority. Two explanations spring to mind. Firstly, the focus on using less and less water is clearly impacting on our washing machine’s ability to rinse effectively. Whereas modern detergents can facilitate efficient and effective washing results at lower temperatures and with less water, no such product is currently allowing effective rinsing with much less water.
Good rinsing needs plenty of water which is in direct opposition to the current environmental concerns and clamour to be the washing machine using the least amount of water.
Eco LabelsThe second explanation I can think of is that the eco-labelling system which awards ratings for energy efficiency, spin efficiency and wash efficiency do not appear to take into account rinse efficiency.
As such, manufacturers aren’t being judged on how well their washing machines rinse, only on how well they wash and how well they extract water on spin. I’m speculating at this stage, but I can’t see how so many washing machines could be awarded an “A” wash efficiency rating if the tests took into account how well the clothes were rinsed. Presumably, as long as all stains are removed and laundry looks “clean” no one bothers about how much soap detergent residue is left.
It might be a good idea to create a fourth category, “rinse efficiency” on the eco labels, or at least include the rinse efficiency as part of the wash efficiency test.
Ultimately if customers don’t notice an issue then it could be argued that it doesn’t really matter.
Maybe it doesn’t for most people, but it surely does to anyone sensitive to wash detergents and with allergies and a lot of people are. There were 581 comments added on this topic from such people before I had to close comments to prevent it being endless.
The current situation is that to anyone keen to buy a washing machine with good rinsing I have no washing machine to recommend because none of the companies producing the best, and the most reliable washing machines currently supply one that rinses above average according to Which? although this could easily change and you would need to check out the latest to be sure.
Are Which? being too critical? Are Which? applying too stringent a rinse test? I must admit I’ve not had many complaints from people saying their washing machine isn’t rinsing properly and my own Miele washing machine, which although a Which? Best Buy, didn’t receive a “good” rating for rinsing yet it appears to rinse perfectly well as far as we can see.
In fact I remarked to my wife that my clothes don’t smell of detergent like they used to in the old washing machine and deduced that it rinsed much better. However, neither of us have any reactions to washing machine detergent. The thing about Which? is that they are totally independent.
They work only for their subscribers interests and are actually a registered charity. They don’t make any money directly by recommending any product (even though they could) because they want to be seen as 100% unbiased. They are highly respected and I expect they test products fairly. However, my understanding is that the do charge for companies to display their “Best Buy” logo!
I suspect Which? are right and that modern washing machines don’t generally rinse very well because of the reasons I speculate about above. Whether it matters or whether it will change depends on whether enough of the public are bothered, or even notice. The 581 comments added to this article below show that many people do find this a big issue.
Which? research
NOTE: Which? do rate some washing machines as satisfactory for rinsing and even a couple are rated as good, although unfortunately the few rated good (so far) are not so good on reliability.
Which? are constantly reviewing washing machines so if rinsing is particularly important to you it makes sense to become a member and see all the buying advice. I can’t print their advice for copyright reasons.
Here’s how they describe their reviews –
We are of course well known for our traditional product testing. And when we test something like the proverbial washing machine, we will ask the laboratory not only to measure how clean the clothes get, but how much water and energy is used? How easy is it to work out the programmes? What is the machine like on specialist cycles? How long does it take? All these things feed into our best buy criteria.
We will devise the testing schedule by looking at things from the ordinary user’s point of view: and if standard industry methods are not good enough we will devise our own methods ”
Causes of poor rinsing
There are some common causes of poor rinsing even in washing machines that do rinse well that it might be useful to point out. Anyone experiencing poor rinsing problems where washing comes out with detergent residues or white powder streaks should read this – White streaks or residual washing powder after washing
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washer help,
Do you know if chloramine is used in uk tap water ,this
may be one reason why some people are itchy etc.
check out http://www.chloramine.org could explain some peoples
problems and may have nothing to do with washing products
but a problem with the water , the use of chloramine gives
same reaction as what people are getting in the uk ? by
the look of the pictures of skin rash and other related
problems which may not be because of poor rinsing by
washing machines !.
ADY.
Hi ady: Thanks for the link, it looks potentially interesting to anyone with skin reactions. I don’t know if it could in some form be used in detergent but the chloramine is in the water as a replacement for chloride and they are using it in parts of the UK as well as USA it seems. Both are highly controversial chemicals to be putting in people’s water.
My point about the lime issue you raised is that all detergent contains water softening agents to combat limescale, which is only produced when water is heated, so there shouldn’t be any limescal problems unless underdosing. Otherwise the product is clearly unfit for its purpose. I haven’t heard of the problem you described to be honest.
Reading comments #356 to #358 inclusive, I’ve not heard about the chloramine issue, however if you wish to eliminate laundry detergent being an issue, it’s important to make sure that PLENTY of warm or hot water is added when re-rinsing. The water level should be high enough (up to 1/2 way up the door) and the porthole door glass should feel slightly warm. You’ll be amazed at how much detergent is released from clothes you thought were rinsed properly!! I’ve got my hot water set at 70C, so this higher temperature takes into account that the water cools down as you pour it into the soap drawer and it trickles down into the drum and hits the cold water already there. Eventually, as the volume of warm water increases, the final temperature for rinsing is about 40 – 45C, safe for cottons.
For limescale issues, this is why I always use one spoonful of soda crystals as this guarantees that the hard water doesn’t cause any problems, however I see you use Sainsbury’s water softener. Yes I know using the correct dosage of detergent is supposed to combat limescale, but sometimes you have to use less, i.e. when washing towels or smaller loads, otherwise you get too much foaming. If foaming wasn’t an issue, I’m sure people would be using the right amount of detergent every time. For some reason, modern washing machines don’t seem to be much good at flushing out foam like they used to??
If after several months of proper rinsing you’re still having skin problems, maybe it could be the chloramine, but it could be fabric conditioner, even if you’re using Surcare, you may wish to eliminate that.
One tip for everyone reading: you won’t get very good results if you wash below 40C, regardless of what the detergent manufacturers say! The only time I believe it’s necessary to wash at 30C is for very delicate fabrics like silk or net curtains, otherwise it’s 40C or higher for best results.
wm user,
After the tip about ecover from simon i think
that my problem is fixed ????? i hope, and when i say that
i done every thing that is what i have done , like other
people with washing problems ( try this and that)
but when the problem starts and you dont know why
because the washing you done the day before is ok
and today its not ,then you find out the washing
powder has changed ,so then you try more washing
products and find that they are no good .
Then to add to the problem you find out that new
eco washing machines no longer rinse ;after many
tests .
Then add that, fabric conditioner has changed as well
(all of them!) you dont know whats going on, but
then you look on sites like this and hey your not the
only one .
IT IS THE PRODUCT WHICH IS THE PROBLEM as i did not
change the levels of washing powder/fabric conditioner
i was using to mess up my washing and as for my washing
machine ,a CANDY CWB 110 TOTAL WASTE OF SPACE
with its wet and bash wash cycles , having watched
it for hours finding out that it only has one wash cycle
what works if you can call it that ?
THEN YOU GOT THE WATER ! in my area which is
hard that does not help and also the chance that
CHLORAMINE is being put in the water ,i am going to
check to see if it is used in my area .
I Believe it is lime stuck to my clothes not detergent
as i have rewashed with no washing powder or
fabric conditioner and extra rinses and at higher temps
and the lime was still on my clothes , so that is because
the washing powder/ liquid has not done its job and
by the way it is not the suds what has caused my problem.
ADY.
p.s Washing powder/ liquid makers add a suds agent because
we like to see suds/foam here in the uk and i dont think
it is the detergent you are rinsing out , just suds agent!.
I DO HOPE THE ABOVE IS A HELP.
Washerhelp,
I do think that after all the tests i have done with my washing
i have found that if you wash at 40c or above the you are going to have problems with your washing ;eg with having to rerinse etc
because the new types of powder / liquids have been made to
work at lower temps.
What i think has happened is that the powder and liquid does
not have so much softener in it ,so if you do washing at 40c
and above the washing water no longer holds the lime in it
and it sticks to the clothes! and say only 1/3 of the water
when washing ,no wonder the lime stops in the clothes
which is what i believe makes you itch etc.
So now you have to add softener , but the only problem
with that, the powder/liquid has only had tests as it is,
and the makers say it has softener in it which is fine
at 30c and below but not above and is not made to have more
softener added ,so if you do add more softener you get other
problems ? as i have found out.
ady.
I DO THINK THERE ARE GOING TO BE MORE PEOPLE WITH
WASHING PROBLEMS NOW.
@ady quartermain I’m not having any of these problems and I live in a “hard water” area and I’ve not heard anyone in my town say their clothes have lime in them.
I do agree that the constant changes to washing machines, detergents and so on is causing a huge problem. They don’t seem to know the saying “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”. The 2 main problems I notice are 1) detergents foam more now and 2) they seem to smell stronger. The latter is not so much a “problem” as it’s an indication on how well the washing is rinsed upon emptying the drum, i.e. no smell = well rinsed washing (provided the softener used contains no perfumes).
Maybe your washing machine needs descaling? You could use a propriety washing machine descaler at least 2 times, without laundry, on the hottest wash.
I don’t have any problems with lime or bad rinsing. I re-rinse everything in nearly 1/2 drum of warm water added manually, I wash my clothes no cooler than 40C, I use soda crystals in every wash so I can use the amount of detergent recommended for “soft” water and I use Surcare softener. I can get away with using less detergent for small loads and towels to avoid the problems I’ve had with foaming.
Since detergents and add-ons such as Calgon or soda crystals soften the water, there is no limescale in the wash and because the rinses don’t get heated by the washing machine, there is no new limescale being created. Limescale does you no harm and it won’t make you itch, it’s the chemicals in laundry detergents and add-on products that make people itch because they need a hell of a lot of water to rinse them away properly, I mean a LOT of water and water that is at least 40C!!
Have you read the page White streaks or residual washing powder after washing?
It may be helpful.
WMUser Quote:
I’ve since realised that a lot of Which? reviews still do criticise washing machines for rinse abilities and mention in the cons summary that they aren’t very good at rinsing or even poor. Unfortunately their 5 star rating system doesn’t reflect their observations properly at times and I can see many washing machines rated with rinsing abilities ranging from, average, decent, to great, and excellent, but they all have the same 4 stars. That’s not to say they are all wrongly marked, but quite a few are.
I’ve emailed a contact I have there pointing out that something has gone wrong with the rinsing ratings. Hopefully someone will review it and sort it out.
Hi Ady,
I have sat on the side lines of this issue for a while now.
If the marking on your clothing definatley is lime then a water softener or detergent dosed correctly will not remove it as it will be entering throught the rinse cycles as well as the main wash. However lime has nothing to do with the washing machine either, it has to be a problem with your water supply. Has there been any ground works near your house since the issue started, or has your water supplier changed where your water comes from and finally have you fitted a magnetic/elecro-magnetic type water softener? If the latter it will break up the scale and a heavy build up of lime and flush through in insoluble particles thus marking your washing.
Other than that, I do agree with Andy, the detergent or water softener has been underdosed and the lime marks are not lime marks at all, they are limescale.
HTH,
Oliver.
Thanks Oliver: My understanding is that limescale is only created in washing machines when they heat up water. All references to limescale problems I’ve seen talk about limescale in kettles, washing machines, dishwashers, hot water pipes, hot water cylinders and hot plumbing pipework or shower heads. All caused by hot water. I’m not aware of cold water causing any limescale problems although I’m careful to choose my words and use phrases like “I’m not aware” and “as far as I know” etc. I don’t claim to be an expert on limesale though I did research into it for my article on limescale in washing machines & Calgon – Hard water & limescale in washing machines (part 1)
This is an interesting read too Limescale (Wikipedia)
@ady quartermain
I did read your comment carefully and I replied with the possible causes, so we can eliminate things until possibly finding the problem and what could be done to resolve it.
Re: “DOSE IS RIGHT, PRODUCT NO GOOD AND YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE TO ADD EXTRA SOFTENER .”
I still use water softener (soda crystals) in all my washes to eliminate all limescale. As I’m not there to actually see what you’re doing, I can only guess by reading your comments. Is the drum overloaded? That can leave marks on clothes and seriously impair rinsing. Before I start washing a full load, I make sure there is a gap between the top of the clothes and the drum – enough to fit your hand in with the fingers spread apart.
I’ve never heard of “lime” – I’ve always associated that as being limescale when talking about this subject. As for throwing away your clothes, it will take a few months of proper rinsing before skin complaints heal up and every single item of clothing at home and the towels etc have been properly rinsed too. All new clothing should be washed – I hear they add chemicals to them at the factory, not sure if that’s completely true?? I can understand you’re frustrated, but I can’t (and will not) suggest anything more to you. Proper rinsing with any modern washing machine requires a bit of manual intervention and time – sorry, but it does.
@Washerhelp – thank you for contacting “Which?”. I hope you post the response from “Which?” in here. I think they could help us all by refusing to award a “Best Buy” to any washing machine that can’t rinse properly, regardless of how well it performs in all their other tests. Good rinsing should be one of the prerequisites for a “Best Buy”. That would force the manufacturers to change!!