My attention was drawn to rinsing efficiency after noticing that out of dozens of washing machines reviewed by Which? most of them had a poor rating for rinsing. Even those singled out as Best Buys were “poor” at rinsing. Believe it or not, at least one Best Buy was “very poor”. I found that pretty shocking.
From studying the figures it is clear that if “good”, or “very good” rinsing was one of the prerequisites for a Best Buy there would be no Best Buy washing machines or washer dryers at all – not a single one. It appears that Which? have decided to allow the poor rinsing results to be a caveat instead of a best buy killer. Please note however that several Which? best buys are “satisfactory” at rinsing which is something at least.
Out of 125 washing machines and washer dryers tested, a remarkable 75 of them (60%) were rated either “poor” or “very poor” at rinsing with only 3 getting the rating we should expect for all washing machines which is “good”.
The rest were a mere “satisfactory”. To summarise, just less than 3 % of the 125 washers & dryers are “good” at rinsing according to Which?
Since writing this article I’ve discovered Which? no longer give the majority of washing machines 1 or 2 star ratings for rinsing ability, and the majority appear to get 3 or 4 stars. Which? tell me they’ve readjusted their rinse marks to more accurately reflect the degrees of abilities between even poor rinsing machines. However, they are still critical of many of their rinsing abilities in the comments and the pros and cons.
What does this mean?
Well for a start it doesn’t mean that we can settle for one of the three washing machines that are “good” at rinsing because they unfortunately let themselves down in other areas such as with “noisy spin, and poor brand reliability”. However, if you really need a washing machine that rinses better than any other – maybe because of allergies – then at least Which? have identified three candidates out of the 125 they’ve tested so far.
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Why aren’t they rinsing properly and does it really matter?
Surely all washing machines should rinse well? It’s surely quite simple, you just use enough water to rinse them properly. It’s astounding that we have reached the situation where the majority of washing machines and washer dryers on sale in the UK are apparently poor at rinsing.
This has probably come about because people have been focussing on other aspects, which has left rinsing as a low priority. Two explanations spring to mind. Firstly, the focus on using less and less water is clearly impacting on our washing machine’s ability to rinse effectively. Whereas modern detergents can facilitate efficient and effective washing results at lower temperatures and with less water, no such product is currently allowing effective rinsing with much less water.
Good rinsing needs plenty of water which is in direct opposition to the current environmental concerns and clamour to be the washing machine using the least amount of water.
Eco LabelsThe second explanation I can think of is that the eco-labelling system which awards ratings for energy efficiency, spin efficiency and wash efficiency do not appear to take into account rinse efficiency.
As such, manufacturers aren’t being judged on how well their washing machines rinse, only on how well they wash and how well they extract water on spin. I’m speculating at this stage, but I can’t see how so many washing machines could be awarded an “A” wash efficiency rating if the tests took into account how well the clothes were rinsed. Presumably, as long as all stains are removed and laundry looks “clean” no one bothers about how much soap detergent residue is left.
It might be a good idea to create a fourth category, “rinse efficiency” on the eco labels, or at least include the rinse efficiency as part of the wash efficiency test.
Ultimately if customers don’t notice an issue then it could be argued that it doesn’t really matter.
Maybe it doesn’t for most people, but it surely does to anyone sensitive to wash detergents and with allergies and a lot of people are. There were 581 comments added on this topic from such people before I had to close comments to prevent it being endless.
The current situation is that to anyone keen to buy a washing machine with good rinsing I have no washing machine to recommend because none of the companies producing the best, and the most reliable washing machines currently supply one that rinses above average according to Which? although this could easily change and you would need to check out the latest to be sure.
Are Which? being too critical? Are Which? applying too stringent a rinse test? I must admit I’ve not had many complaints from people saying their washing machine isn’t rinsing properly and my own Miele washing machine, which although a Which? Best Buy, didn’t receive a “good” rating for rinsing yet it appears to rinse perfectly well as far as we can see.
In fact I remarked to my wife that my clothes don’t smell of detergent like they used to in the old washing machine and deduced that it rinsed much better. However, neither of us have any reactions to washing machine detergent. The thing about Which? is that they are totally independent.
They work only for their subscribers interests and are actually a registered charity. They don’t make any money directly by recommending any product (even though they could) because they want to be seen as 100% unbiased. They are highly respected and I expect they test products fairly. However, my understanding is that the do charge for companies to display their “Best Buy” logo!
I suspect Which? are right and that modern washing machines don’t generally rinse very well because of the reasons I speculate about above. Whether it matters or whether it will change depends on whether enough of the public are bothered, or even notice. The 581 comments added to this article below show that many people do find this a big issue.
Which? research
NOTE: Which? do rate some washing machines as satisfactory for rinsing and even a couple are rated as good, although unfortunately the few rated good (so far) are not so good on reliability.
Which? are constantly reviewing washing machines so if rinsing is particularly important to you it makes sense to become a member and see all the buying advice. I can’t print their advice for copyright reasons.
Here’s how they describe their reviews –
We are of course well known for our traditional product testing. And when we test something like the proverbial washing machine, we will ask the laboratory not only to measure how clean the clothes get, but how much water and energy is used? How easy is it to work out the programmes? What is the machine like on specialist cycles? How long does it take? All these things feed into our best buy criteria.
We will devise the testing schedule by looking at things from the ordinary user’s point of view: and if standard industry methods are not good enough we will devise our own methods ”
Causes of poor rinsing
There are some common causes of poor rinsing even in washing machines that do rinse well that it might be useful to point out. Anyone experiencing poor rinsing problems where washing comes out with detergent residues or white powder streaks should read this – White streaks or residual washing powder after washing
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Rod : a Miele engineer reprogrammed the electronics on my machine in an attempt to bring in more water, but it didn’t bring in enough, so he then cut something – I think it was a pipe – which brings in more, but still not enough.
Maybe the advice for washing in hot programmes – 60 degrees or higher, is to use a little less detergent if the excess foaming is a problem. It sure is for me. Avoid washing small loads if possible, I find that creates too much foam at any temperature.
One of the advantages of re-running programmes without detergent (after the first spin) is the first ‘wash’ of the second programme without detergent acts as a warm rinse. However, I can imagine if a washing machine performed, say, 4 rinses with the water temperature at 40 degrees and using lots of water every time, your electric bill would be very high! It would also take ages from start to finish!! Unless it was filling from the hot water supply?
If warm rinsing is a must, one risky method could be to pour a kettle full of hot (not boiling!) water into the rinsing water, once the machine has filled with cold water, if you can.
Does anyone find that premium brands i.e. Persil are worth the price? I have found Sainsburys own brand laundry products as good. Also washing powder contains plastic ‘fillers’ and bulking agents (sodium sulfate) and that can’t be good for the clothes or the machine? Always have used a liquid as it rinses better but do a maintenance wash once a month with powder containing oxygen bleach.
Hi all, is me again, I feel so rude about forgetting about this whole thread, just found it again after sorting out my Hotmail!
I still have to say that, despite being a water efficient machine, our Miele rinses superbly compared to our other older machines – we very rarely use water plus or the extra rinse as often I’m far too much in a rush to wait an extra 15 minutes. We use Ariel or Persil (whichever is on offer really), and we have no skin problems even though 3 of us, myself included, have severe eczema, which can be heavily aggravated by perfumed shower gels, softeners etc. However, my sister suffers from extreme eczema, yet she uses Fairy in a modern Zanussi Essential. Curiously, I noticed the other day when she had the Extra Rinse option selected, that even though adding 2 or 3 rinses, it won’t spin after the rinse cycles AT ALL (this is on cottons 40, which should spin after each rinse), and only does a brief, very slow spin before the softener rinse, before doing the normal 1200rpm spin at the end – thus, giving no better results than if she didn’t press extra rinse, as this would mean at least the washer will spin between rinses to get excess detergent out.
I think I mentioned before, but I’ll say it again, and I firmly believe it’s not just the water level which is a major factor during rinsing, but the interim spins too. One of the reasons why I personally think our Miele rinses so well is that it spins at 1000rpm for about 3 or 4 minutes after the wash (yes, I’ve been sad enough to fiddle with the spin selector mid cycle to see how fast it spins at!), and will spin at 1000rpm between the first rinse and the softener rinse. It makes sense if you think about it that most of the detergent is being spun out after the wash, hence less water and rinses being needed. I’ve noticed with Hotpoints and our old Bosch Exxcel in operation that the spins are quite brief and slow between the wash and the rinses – the Hotpoints/Indesits I’ve seen just do a series of bursts and a short spin rather than a full on spin after the wash – which in turn would hinder rinsing as more sudsy water is remaining in the load by the time the rinse cycle has started – this being even more exagerrated in my sisters Zanussi with the extra rinse being selected, as excess detergent and suds aren’t being removed at all before the rinse phase begins.
I think if more machines did a decent, long, fast spin after the wash and between the rinses, like our Miele, then the lower water levels wouldn’t matter, however it seems some manufacturers like Hotpoint, Indesit and Zanussi have cut down the water level, but not altered the interim spins accordingly.
Simon – we’ve used Sainsbury’s and Asda’s own before, and they are fair. However, we’ve always noticed that if we’ve been using own brand stuff and switch back to the main 3, i.e. Persil/Ariel/Bold, that stuff seems so much cleaner and whiter! BTW using liquid all the time will result in dingy whites, as optical brighteners alone don’t do as good a job as when they are in tandem with oxygen bleach in powders and tablets.
Jon
Hi Nikki,
I can see where you are coming from with warm rinsing due to my dishwasher rinsing a lot better. I see your Miele engineer increased the water level to 1/2 way up the door, you say this is not enough and to my knowledge no machine not even in the 70’s and 80’s has put water any higher. They did do more rinse cycles though usually 4 or 5. Did you think of connecting it to a hot supply as per comment 165?
However my Bosch does rinse properly in cold water, we used to have a Servis Quartz which also rinsed properly in cold. I have never come across a machine that will rinse with warm water except for some American top loaders, you can buy them over here as well so this may also be a consideration for better rinsing.
Oliver.
Hi WMUser,
I have just thought of something about rerunning a high water use cycle, they all tend to be delicate cycles, so there will not be proper agitation and it may not spin between the rinses, or if it does it will be reduced. So may rinse no better than the normal cycle. Your original idea of rerunning the rinse cycle only could be better, just an idea but it has only just occurred to me after seeing my Mums Siltal on a delicate cycle, it uses more water, a lot less agitation and NO intermediate spins.
Its funny you should mention the foam in washing powders, I was also thinking washing powders were producing a lot more foam than they used to. They do seem to foam more on hotter washes as you say, they do wash longer though, so that could be why? Again in My Mums Siltal it will foam half way up the door on a 70 degrees cycle (washes for 40 minutes before rinsing) with a properly measured dose, she uses Ariel Powder by the way. My Bosch tends not to foam up at all, a little bit runs down the door, I have also used Ariel and have not seen my machine froth like that not even on “Whites Economy” (40 minute 60 deg C wash, before rinsing). I use Persil at the moment and it seems to froth less than Ariel, perhaps trying different brand may be a consideration.
Oliver.
Hi Simon,
Personally I find the premium brand washing powders to work a lot better. It probably depends on what you are washing, if everything you wash is lightly soiled you would probably see no difference at all. My overalls and work clothes will not come clean with own brand detergents, they come up spotless in Ariel or Persil bio powders, even on Cotton 60 deg C and “Short wash” selected.
I too have found liquids to rinse out better but they do not kill germs in either the laundry or the machine, call me old fashioned but the idea of wearing second hand sweat is slightly off putting, so for me the bio powders win hands down! At least you do your monthly maintenance wash!
My Mum has also said she would never use the own brands as she too says they do not clean properly, they cannot shift grease etc. out of my Dads overalls but Ariel can (70 deg C wash). So for me the own brands are rubbish in comparison. Certain detergents work better in certain machines.
Ariel works better in the Siltal.
Persil works better in the Bosch.
You are correct about washing powders having plastic “fillers” in, this is why Ariel and Persil have recently concentrated their formulas to reduce the amount of plastic in their formulations. Also some of the packers are builders or water softeners which help protect the machine from limescale build up. Liquids contain these as well but a lot of the filling in a liquid is water. They will not harm the machine in the least, only if you overdose on a permanent basis or never do a maintenance wash. But if used correctly and a monthly 90/95 deg C you will be fine! Its detergent abuse that damages your machine and the laundry. But most folk will not read the package or get the scoop out!
Oliver.
Hi again,
I think that my Hotpoint is brilliant the way is rinses the laundry, especially with the 1000rpm intermediate spin in between EVERY rinse (even with Extra Rinse which I use nearly all the time) I just hate the fact people put Hotpoint down all the time, when I couldn’t care as it washes, rinses and spins just fine :D
~The Miele is still in bits, although at last hubby has all the parts needed to replace the bearing and fit the two drums back into the machine and put everything back together – hopefully! If it works, I have decided that what I will do is set the machine up to wash in the middle of the night, when our electricity is at its cheapest, and then leave it standing in the machine all day, and then set it up to wash again the following night, but this time with no detergent. It will then “test” one or two bits of laundry by rinsing them by hand, and if they are reasonably soap free, then that will do. If not, the machine will be set up again to do a third soap free wash.
We can’t rig our washing machine up to the hot water fill – because our hot water is heated by our Coalbrookdale wood burner, as well as by the oil boiler and an immersion too if we want, the water would often be far too hot – although it has to be said all our clothes and laundry are cotton or linen, I hate artificial stuff, but I do have some delicate wool jerseys and underwear that needs to be washed on cool. So that, sadly, is not an option. I shall just have to stick with the method as described above, or rinse by hand. I am looking into the white vinegar route if I can find a supermarket or chinese shop that will sell me white vinegar in bulk.
Hi Nikki,
You can still connect the miele to a hot water supply using a Thermostatic Mixing Valve. It uses a hot and cold supply and mixes it to the valves manually set temperature, even if your hot water is 80oC the valve will happily mix it to 35/40oC. They work instantly too, so there will be no damage to the washing machine or your delicate woollens.
TMV Valves are available from companies such as Screwfix and are not overly expensive, just make sure it has the correct threaded ends for the hoses you intend to use.
HTH,
Oliver.